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Forums —» General Caching —» General —» You never know...
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You never know...
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geo_canuck77



Joined: Mar 10, 2009
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 1:23 pm    Post subject: You never know... Reply with quote

Last night a new cache came out, there were some issues with it, coordinates, location. Couple posts where put up, I had also emailed the cache owner as I went to look for it last night. This is the reply I got:

"Hi geo_canuck77

Just to let you know that this is my son's first attempt at getting us back into the Geo Cache hobby after loosing his Dad to cancer. We do appologize for getting things so wrong. He was really trying his hardest, as Dad was the leader of our little 4some. We are very sorry. We were so excited about trying to get something going close to home. We never meant to cause any harm or break any rules, that is for sure. I will talk to my son and we will get things cleaned up and will remove the cache this afternoon.

I am so sorry, I thought that he was doing a great job, I do not want to totally discourage his efforts, but we will try to do better next time

Mom (Laurie)"

Just something to keep in mind when you are writing logs on caches that have issues. You never know who hid them and what the story is. This boy is 13 years old, I will be taking my 12 and 14 year old out with me to help him fix the cache.
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tjguy98



Joined: Aug 06, 2005
Posts: 206
Location: Maple Ridge

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:55 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

A good reminder for us all.....I've been guilty of muttering under my breath while looking for a cache that had issues. Thankfully when I do get home to send an email to the cache owner for verification of the cache hide, the "muttering" part has been replaced with a civil tongue which I use to communicate in my email.

As you said, "you just never know"......last thing any of us want to do is be the bad guy in an email to an undeserving fellow cacher.....

_________________
Read about my geocaching adventures on my website at:
tjguy98.blogspot.com/
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IRLPGUY



Joined: Mar 01, 2007
Posts: 174

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:02 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

Actually, sometimes you do know!!

This very apologetic lady attended the Chilliwack Geocaching 101 event in Feb, along with her daughter. She has been unfairly attacked, and “she” is the one apologizing. I would say that all those who sought this cache for a FTF should be apologizing to her for their comments. The cache page referred to Sardis Park, yet the posted co-ordinates were not in Sardis Park, I could see that as soon as I entered the cache co-ordinates into my GPS. It was incorrectly listed, which should have been caught by the reviewer. Why would anyone else “not” have assumed there was an error, instead of seeking the cache for the almighty FTF.

The submission of this private email shows a lack of discretion and respect for someone in the position this lady finds herself, and should never have been posted to these forums. Since it has been put here for all to see, I would ask: Does this email sound like it is coming from someone who has just received an offer of help? Or does it sound like a person who has had criticism posted to her cache page, and is responding to what I would suspect was the same in a personal email as well.

I would suggest that if any one of those that sought this cache and made offers to help were really intent in helping from the beginning, they would have submitted their original email here in this forum as an example of “how helping a new cacher should be done” and not make the offer after this person has apologized, and confided some of her very personal information. This of course could still be done, thereby proving me wrong, however I doubt the original emails made any offer of help.

There is no place for personal emails and information to be put in these public forums, no matter the reason. This should have been deleted as soon as it was noticed. Do the right thing and remove this thread, unless it is confirmed this lady has agreed to have her email posted..
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Doonchak



Joined: Sep 07, 2008
Posts: 81

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:28 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

Are we really going to start this again? Can't you two just ignore each other or something. For goodness sakes Yuck
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geodug



Joined: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 161

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:44 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

What is going on here?

GeoCanuck is very clearly trying to help out a fellow cacher and he is getting jumped on.

I read the post and have no idea who is being helped other than a first name in what is supposed to be an email GeoCanuck received. Other than that I have no clue who is being referenced. I imagine people who know her understand more than me but then they know the rest of the story as well.

In these difficult days when there is a shortage of human kindness everywhere you look, I find GeoCanuck's efforts be be what we need more of.

Or is there something I am missing?
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gearhedd



Joined: Feb 16, 2007
Posts: 124

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:20 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

Personal emails should not be posted with names included. I wouldn't want my emails to be forwarded, copied, or put on this site or any other that I have sent to any of you. I would agree this post should be removed unless it was agreed to be posted.

Onto "you never know" we should never jump unto someone even if they are seasoned cachers, I have made mistakes with my caches coord, a stage, one number off and its all wrong. And when cachers responded they did so nicely, cachers went back twice that day before I got home to fix the prob. and they were sad no to get FTF but were understanding about the mistake. Its only a game and should not be taken so seriously. If someone went a long way to try to get a FTF and the coords were wrong....oh well! If you want to go for caches that are correct or there then go for those that have been found the day before.... going to find a FTF has its draw backs and you should know them and live with them.
..............and thats me. If it happens to be a newbie or someone with family issues just the more reason.. to first be understanding.
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IRLPGUY



Joined: Mar 01, 2007
Posts: 174

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:27 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

Yes something is being missed or misinterpreted here.

There were 2 posts to the cache page, there was at least 2 perhaps 3 personal emails sent to the cache owner. I believe geo_canuck77 has, or will be helping this lady’s Son out with the cache placement, that is good.

My point which Geodug and Doonchak seem to have missed is that originally there was no offer of help. There was indeed criticism, and it was only after this Mom responded to a personal email from at least one person did someone offer her and her Son assistance.

The point being made by the original post to this thread, regarding posts to cache pages, could have been far better made had that post been a submission of a “first contact” personal email to the owner which genuinely offered help with no criticism. That was not done, instead her response to an email was used to make a point. That is what is wrong here, and it makes no difference who is making the point.

Neither Doonchak nor Geodug live in this community and you certainly are not aware of things that happen here. This lady made an attempt to become informed and gain further knowledge about geocaching by attending the geocaching 101 event, that is more than can be said for some who sought and criticized her Son’s cache.

This is not about geo_canuck77 and I, it is about the method in which someone chose to put forward a point about posts to a cache page, there was no mention of possible content of personal emails to her and their ramifications. I am sure those were at least as upsetting to her as was the posts to her Son’s cache page.

When I returned from a day of caching in Surrey and Langley yesterday, and read the posts to the cache page, I sent her an email immediately, which read:

Good afternoon (Cacher's name removed);

Don't be too upset about your cache, there are some problems with it but
nothing that you can't sort out. If you would like "any" help at all please
feel free to email myself or Solonm. We met you at the geocaching 101 event.
Take heart all will be ok.

Don't be embarrassed to ask for some help if you need it.

Cheers
Ed – Irlpguy

I do not feel the need to share her response to my offer here on a public forum.

*Edited by goaliegirl38 to remove cacher's name
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Teddy2k



Joined: Sep 12, 2008
Posts: 358
Location: Rosedale, BC

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:56 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

The point of this thread, in my opinion, is to highlight the importance of not posting negative comments or personal opinions or gripes in a log on geocaching.com. In this case, the cache had 3 very unnecessary and very negative comments posted by 3 local cachers. I have no idea if these 3 cachers also followed up with a personal email to the cache owner, however these 3 logs never EVER should have been posted for all to see. Personally, I would lose it if someone posted a log like that on one of my caches. I even go as far as asking cachers to remove sections of their logs that don't pertain to the actual cache and the trek to find it. I don't appreciate my caches being derailed by having these sort of logs posted.

I applaud geo_canuck77 for the assistance that was offered IN PRIVATE. I have read the email that he sent to the cache owner and know for a fact that they have set a time and place to meet (geo_canuck77 has a son the same age as the young cacher in question). Hopefully they will be able to fix the cache and have it re-posted soon.
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geodug



Joined: Apr 13, 2004
Posts: 161

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:38 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

In general, other person's email should not be published . However, GeoCanuck did not reveal the cache or the cacher name in question. When I read his post I understood him to say that we should help people out whenever we have a chance.

Up until IRLPGuy's post just above, I had no idea the cacher or the cache in question. IRLPGuy has revealed who it was which I had no interest in because that wasn't the point of the story. So from where I'm standing the privacy of the individual's identity was kept until now.

So back to the original point. Why are we not celebrating one cacher's willingness to help another? Finally, that cacher apparently has arranged to go out as two families to fix up the problem.
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geo_canuck77



Joined: Mar 10, 2009
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:48 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

Wow some interesting posts, not surprised though.

Thanks Teddy2k and other that replied. I met the mother and her son today and we looked at the final location and they realize why it wasn't the best spot and has been moved. Also made a couple documents with screen shots to show the young man how to change his coordinates and create a waypoint for the final location. I did leave them to finish the hide on the last stage and then update the 1st stage which I never found yet.

"The submission of this private email shows a lack of discretion and respect for someone in the position this lady finds herself, and should never have been posted to these forums."

For the record, no where in my post said the cacher's name, but you did in your post!!! Nice back pedaling on the 2nd post though...geez will it ever end.
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CAMOKELLY



Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 482
Location: Abbotsford BC

PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:09 pm    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

Not sure if it matters or if anyone cares but my post that night was not to attack the owner rather to warn other seekers of the many problems there was with the cache listing and that I did not think or for that matter want anyone else to try and look for the cache before it was fixed up. I had thought about whether I should just privately email the owner and leave it at that but then thought perhaps I should make a note so others do not try to attempt the cache and create even more of a problem. So I posted my note and then immediately emailed the owner firstly asking her not to be offended by my post or this email and then laid out what problems there were with the listing and placement and followed that up with an offer to help her in any way I could if she wished. I did not get a reply back and assumed her post on the cache page was my answer. I do not personally think I did anything wrong and felt I took all necessary steps needed to be done as a responsible cacher finding a dire caching problem.
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IRLPGUY



Joined: Mar 01, 2007
Posts: 174

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 7:19 am    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

First let me thank Goaligirl38 for removing the cachers name from my post, cut and paste is not always the best and it was not intended to be there.
Secondly, Bravo to geo_canuck77 for helping this family get their cache headed in the right direction, helping them in the end was never in question, only the method of the original post.

Now I would like to quote geo_canuck77’s last few words on his last post: “For the record, no where in my post said the cacher's name, but you did in your post!!! Nice back pedaling on the 2nd post though...geez will it ever end.”

I did not question the use of the email because the cachers name was identified, that had nothing to do with it, I questioned it because she had sent rather personal information, let’s be straight about that.

Finally and since this will be my last post, your words “geez will it ever end”. To this I would like to say Thank you, for the latest in your poisonous, personal name calling emails which I received at 8:31 last evening, it goes along nicely with all the others you have sent to me through my personal email address, which as you know I have chosen not to respond to. Truly will it ever end.

Lets now let this thread end, it is serving no useful purpose. Let it remain as a reminder of how not to conduct a forum topic.
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geo_canuck77



Joined: Mar 10, 2009
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:11 am    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

TESKELLY this wasn't pointed towards you in anyway. Just to make a point that if we don't know who the cacher is we should be careful how we word our posts.

Ed, I never used any swear words in my email to you but meant every word of it. If you choose to share it go ahead.

I'm still waiting for your little games to end. Like below.

You emailed Teddy2k before you left for his new cache and he told you I went and got it that night, yet you both still post making me look bad. I never got home that night until late and with 4 boys to put in bed posting my log wasn't on my mind. Even after I posted my log explaining myself SOLOMN still posts what she put. Teddy2k has asked you to fix your logs, hopefully you do.

www.geocaching.com/see...81ee628d23
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Mrs_Landsharkz



Joined: Dec 04, 2008
Posts: 295
Location: Victoria

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 10:00 am    Post subject: Re: You never know... Reply with quote

This is a pretty sad thread to read - this is a game folks and we should be nice to other people just as if they were sitting across the table playing cards together.

There is an appropriate place to deal with these issues and it's Groundspeak.

Scenario #1 - The appropriate channel for rude e-mails that come through your geocaching.com profile is to report it to the powers at Groundspeak. It clearly says that "All email correspondence through the web site is logged to reduce abuse and increase security.Your IP address (XX.XX.XXX.XX) will be logged. Do not abuse the use of this feature".

If the e-mails are coming through your personal account instead of your geocaching.com profile link, them block them and get on with your life.

Scenario #2... someone posts a nasty log on your cache, you get a notification e-mail from Groundspeak where you get to read their initial log and you want to throttle them! By the time you get to the cache page, the log has been changed and it's now all nice... you should send the Groundspeak generated e-mail that you got with the rude log directly to Groundspeak and 'report' it... even though it's not there for everyone to see on the cache listing anymore.

I can't say that I've ever had to use this feature here on Vancouver Island and I hope I never do. This morning I saw a new cache come out 100m from our friend Charbs' apartment and rather than racing over to nab the FTF, I phoned the newly returned sailor, and told him to get out of bed and hurry out there! It's a game, right?!

Sometimes we have so many people at a FTF that we call it a 'cache party' or 'impromptu event' - it's almost disappointing to be FTF and have nobody else show up to celebrate with you or help find it!

Hmmmm... let's hope they don't ever put in that bridge. Confused
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